Event Replay: Context First: Growth Through Connection

00:00:00:05 - 00:00:24:06 Joshua Zerkel Hello and welcome to context first with gradual and today's topic growth through connection. I'm Josh circle, head of marketing and community here at gradual. In case you are new to gradual, it's the all in one engagement and community platform to generate context across go to market and turn connection into lasting business impact. Before I introduce our guest expert, just a quick note.

00:00:24:08 - 00:00:51:04 Joshua Zerkel Please drop your questions in the Q&A and we'll get to as many as we can. I encourage you to ask questions. We love those. And now, without further ado, I'd like to introduce you to our guest, Audrey Vandenberg, head of Customer support Operations at Scribd. Audrey's a seasoned customer. Success and support exact. With over 15 years of experience scaling global teams across B2B and B2C SaaS organizations.

00:00:51:07 - 00:01:13:21 Joshua Zerkel A four time founding customer success leader, Audrey's built and transform teams from the ground up, including leading global organizations across multiple continents. Known for her hands on servant leadership style, she thrives at the intersection of strategy and execution, with a deep passion for being close to customers and developing high performing teams. Welcome, Audrey.

00:01:13:23 - 00:01:17:05 Audrey Vandenbroeck Thank you, Josh, and thank you to the gradual team for having me.

00:01:17:08 - 00:01:31:05 Joshua Zerkel We're so thrilled. So just to kick us off, maybe we could start with the core idea behind today's session. When you talk about moving from customer signals to customer context. What do you mean?

00:01:31:07 - 00:02:02:21 Audrey Vandenbroeck Well, that's a loaded question. So, you know, we can take so much from user behaviors by watching, you know, dovetail recordings or hotjar recordings of how users move through certain products. But you only hear, you only watch and see so much of what the user is trying to accomplish. And it can give you some signals on how to move your product forward, or how to design your product a little bit better so that it acclimates to a user's experience within a platform.

00:02:02:23 - 00:02:27:06 Audrey Vandenbroeck But really, the catalyst for the initiative that I before it at issue was to really understand the context of the why and the how and tell me what you're thinking at that moment. And you can't get that from watching, you know, replays and videos, of a user's behavior and actions through the product. So I wanted to get on the horn with a lot of our customers.

00:02:27:08 - 00:02:48:22 Joshua Zerkel Why do you think that is so hard for businesses to do? Like I find just in my homework in the past, just talking with leadership, they're like, well, can't we just do a survey or can't we just read or listen to the existing calls? Why do we need to spend extra time really seeking out feedback and listening? Why does why do you think that's challenging?

00:02:48:25 - 00:03:13:23 Audrey Vandenbroeck I think one, you mentioned the word it's time. There is desire and there's want to watch a video or read responses to a survey, but it's putting out the effort and setting aside the time to do so. It is again, what is the user actually trying to express in this survey response? It's all very at the surface.

00:03:13:25 - 00:03:27:16 Audrey Vandenbroeck There are follow up questions to be had, but there's no opportunity to ask them. And so again creating a form with human, human, human to human interaction was what was needed at the time.

00:03:27:18 - 00:03:40:26 Joshua Zerkel Makes sense. Well, take us back. Let's go to the Wayback machine to when you were starting Campfire Stories. How did that program come together? What were you trying to solve at that point? How did that get started and start going?

00:03:40:28 - 00:04:04:00 Audrey Vandenbroeck My CEO looked at me and said, you like talking to people. It's why you're in Customer Success. I think we need to do something a little bit different, and I think our organization needs to be involved. Can you figure it out? Okay. What's our desired outcome? We need to be able to speak to our customers. Great. That's a very at the surface desired outcome.

00:04:04:03 - 00:04:24:13 Audrey Vandenbroeck What else can you give me? I don't know, you'll figure it out. You'll figure out what it is we need to know from this, strategic play. Once we actually execute it. Okay, great. So in my history of being in customer success, it's very natural for me to want to speak to our customers. I think every engagement is a gift.

00:04:24:16 - 00:04:43:29 Audrey Vandenbroeck If that's through email or chat or on the phone or through a zoom call, it's a gift because it allows me to dig deeper into how customers think and why they chose our product to partner with for their livelihood to succeed at their organization. And so when coming up with this idea of campfire stories, I wanted something kind of casual.

00:04:44:00 - 00:05:10:01 Audrey Vandenbroeck So if you're camping or a camper, you know, you're sitting by the fireside, you're roasting marshmallows, you're just telling stories. You're just telling stories of whatever it is you want to share. And I wanted that casual, relaxed vibe to carry through, into this initiative. I wanted the, our customers to feel like, oh, this is a human, human interaction.

00:05:10:04 - 00:05:36:29 Audrey Vandenbroeck I'm going to tell Audrey everything I want to tell her because I'm comfortable speaking with her. And that was the kind of tone and environment I was trying to set. As for the, you know, the framework of it all, I took inspiration, from a previous a prior TV show. My date myself. Now. Josh. It's called Inside the Actors Studio with James Lipton.

00:05:37:02 - 00:06:08:19 Audrey Vandenbroeck He would bring actors on stage and ask them a series of questions, but he would always ask the same ten questions at the end of their interview. And I thought his approach was very methodical and very smart, because if he asked all of his guests the same ten questions, the answers would obviously be very different. But there were always very poignant questions to achieve an outcome, and that's how I positioned campfire Stories at issue.

00:06:08:21 - 00:06:16:19 Joshua Zerkel That's awesome. What was the initial response to you launching this program, both from the customer perspective and from your leadership perspective?

00:06:16:22 - 00:06:43:13 Audrey Vandenbroeck From a customer perspective, it was a win win. Everyone was excited to participate and to have their voices heard. Customers love to talk, especially if it's about their own company growth or their own personal self growth, and reaching out to customers to want to participate in a 30 minute session just like this was quite easy to have. I did have pre calls with them to give them an idea of how the flow would work.

00:06:43:13 - 00:07:12:14 Audrey Vandenbroeck The types of questions I would be asking, but I also was able to retrieve a lot of their whys and their how's and their thought process. So my follow up questions were tailored for them and they just felt heard. You know, a lot of the times when you work in customer success or customer support, they always think there is is there someone behind the screen answering my questions, or is it a bot or is it an automated message?

00:07:12:16 - 00:07:38:27 Audrey Vandenbroeck But to have me approach them and say, we want to speak with you about your business? They were just like, okay, when I'm going for you tomorrow, my C-suite team and the rest of my organization also bought into this because it was a way to bring our organization together as a community to listen to what our customers wanted to say and wanted to share with us.

00:07:38:29 - 00:08:10:13 Audrey Vandenbroeck It also allowed them the opportunity to ask burning questions that they may have never had had the chance to to ask without this forum. And each C-suite leader backs this initiative and really down to their direct reports, who then reported down to their direct reports saying, here's a company wide initiative that's going to benefit all of your work, no matter what role you are within the organization, you need to attend these campfires.

00:08:10:15 - 00:08:36:03 Joshua Zerkel Yeah, I think that that ability to have the conversation that so many people internally can benefit from, while also making the customer feel like they've been listened to, like they've been heard. All of us want to be seen and feel like we've been heard inside and outside of work. And I found just from a different perspective on the community side, when customers feel like they get to meet people behind the company, like for them, we're like magic makers.

00:08:36:03 - 00:08:51:28 Joshua Zerkel They don't know what's inside the box, but when they meet the people who who build it, who sell it, who marketed, who support it, and who help them be successful for them. If you do it well, it can be an amazing experience. And for us, we get insights that we could never get elsewhere just by having a conversation.

00:08:52:00 - 00:09:13:13 Audrey Vandenbroeck Exactly. It indirectly let our customers know that yeah, we have your back. We understand your business a lot better now. Now we know how to position our product for greater use and greater adoption, because we understand what your pain points are and what you're trying to solve down to the very root. And you don't get that through a survey.

00:09:13:14 - 00:09:29:04 Audrey Vandenbroeck You don't get that through an email interaction. You don't get that through, you know, comments left on our help center pages when they're looking for resources. And so this gave us the opportunity, again, to really understand our customer's pain points.

00:09:29:07 - 00:09:53:24 Joshua Zerkel What do you think made the campers campfire stories format more effective than those other, more standard feedback mechanisms? Because I think in my experience, most companies rely on that. Let's send a survey or let's do a quick form or something like that, or reply to this email with your feedback. More hand. What do you think made campfire stories uniquely effective in going beyond just feedback?

00:09:53:27 - 00:10:22:14 Audrey Vandenbroeck Yeah, I was really transparent with the customers that we invited to our campfire stories and let them know my entire organization will most likely participate. They might have a lot of questions. You're going to get a lot of questions from all departments of the organization. So there's going to be some context switching, but it's genuinely coming from a place of wonder and curiosity, which I think has fallen by the wayside in recent years.

00:10:22:14 - 00:10:48:18 Audrey Vandenbroeck Right. Like being genuinely curious about who our customers are. And so I, I wanted to lead our customers down a path of success by getting them so ready for whatever types of questions that they're going to be presented with that they knew how to answer, but at the same time make them feel comfortable. Based on my pace, my tone and my my comfort, if you will.

00:10:48:21 - 00:11:00:25 Audrey Vandenbroeck Again, it's supposed to mirror that campfire feel where everyone just kind of hunkered down for the evening, relaxed environment, and they wanted them to feel that.

00:11:00:27 - 00:11:21:01 Joshua Zerkel You know, that's amazing. It's funny, I have been at organizations where we've been what I would frame is truly customer centric, where we really do want to listen to customers. And I've been at others which shall remain nameless to protect the innocent. Or maybe less in a sense, where I legitimately have conversations internally where people said we know better than our customers what they need.

00:11:21:02 - 00:11:44:24 Joshua Zerkel We don't need to ask them for feedback. And so the depth to which you've crafted the Campfire Stories initiative to really get the the not just feedback, but insights, emotions, thought processes and motivations behind what drives customers. I think that is truly when you get really customer centric, that's the type of thing that you create. I'm wondering, we've talked a little bit about it in concept, but what did it look like in practice?

00:11:44:24 - 00:11:56:26 Joshua Zerkel Like what was the structure of that campfire campfire story conversation? What did that look like in practice to get to a place of not just feedback, but like people to really open up?

00:11:56:28 - 00:12:20:25 Audrey Vandenbroeck Yeah. So we instituted the campfire series in all of our conversations. So after a campfire story was completed, we would have someone circulated. They weren't present for it. They'd have. It was a mandate. You'd have to watch it. And then in our conversations, if it was a, you know, product saying maybe it was a sprint, maybe it was a stand up.

00:12:20:27 - 00:12:46:08 Audrey Vandenbroeck We always applied what we learned from our customers in those conversations. There was always a reference point for all members of the organization. They'd be like, remember that one time we had this customer from this particular industry and their persona was this. That's the exact market that we're trying to hit up right now. Remember what they said? Do you think that, you know, this is applicable, widespread or just that one customer like it?

00:12:46:08 - 00:13:10:06 Audrey Vandenbroeck It extended our conversations beyond the reach of just a normal survey response that we would get back. And it was instituted in our brains, like during all of our meetings. Reference back to the conversation that we just had with this customer, right. Let's think about why they said what they said. Right. And so it became a little bit more meaningful.

00:13:10:12 - 00:13:50:02 Audrey Vandenbroeck It brought everyone on the at the table on the same page because we all heard the same responses. We all heard the same answers. How we interpreted and perceived them were all different, which created for some really healthy dialog. It but it was it was necessary because now we were making, strategic decisions and, you know, building product roadmaps that were significant to our customers, which in turn would speed up adoption, which in turn would improve our retention numbers, would in turn, you know, have a successful revenue month.

00:13:50:04 - 00:14:01:07 Audrey Vandenbroeck Right? So it was this trickle down effect, right? And everyone bought into that bigger picture. And so that's how we implemented it throughout our conversations.

00:14:01:10 - 00:14:18:17 Joshua Zerkel I love that. One of the things that you touched on a little bit is something that I've seen in my own career, which is this concept of persona versus person. I feel like in the world, especially if you go to market, oftentimes we we anchor on this archetype of the persona. There's this person we put on a poster board.

00:14:18:17 - 00:14:53:00 Joshua Zerkel We have pictures of what we think they look like. Here are some of the things that are of concern to them. This is completely made up and fake. And yet a lot of our organizations really rely on this idea of this ICP or this persona, the fake person that we think is our buyer or our user. And when it comes to the work that you do, especially if you're a customer facing role like CSS or community or sales support, you work with the person, not the persona, the actual human who is at the end of the cycle that's actually using your product or your service.

00:14:53:02 - 00:15:03:18 Joshua Zerkel How have you found, especially you, the campfire stories that you were able to bring that person element into the work where there might otherwise be this notion of a persona?

00:15:03:21 - 00:15:42:11 Audrey Vandenbroeck Sure. So there were no personas until we actually understood the people behind them, and we built our personas based on every campfire participant that participated with us. And I ran this initiative for years, and we had them at least twice a month, one international and one domestic here in the States. And so that was enough persona profiles to create in response to the different, characteristics, behaviors, roles, aptitude, skill sets of the people that I was having conversations with and that and our personas.

00:15:42:11 - 00:16:12:05 Audrey Vandenbroeck They morphed year over year. We tried to based on the market and how the market moved based on what product delivery we're releasing. Our personas always changed. But after meeting with real people to learn who they are and what they wanted, those pursuing personas after that final iteration remained and that became our persona resource for the rest of my tenure while at issue.

00:16:12:07 - 00:16:25:22 Audrey Vandenbroeck Before our acquisition. So, you know, it definitely helps identify, like, who our actual users were and it made our product decisions better. And are engineering decisions even better?

00:16:25:24 - 00:16:37:18 Joshua Zerkel That's great. Once you've got these conversations in motion and really going, what were some of the things that you were hearing from them that you weren't getting via these other typical, more common feedback or conversation channels?

00:16:37:20 - 00:17:15:07 Audrey Vandenbroeck Yeah. Learning about why they chose to partner with our service and not a competitor of ours, what they were really looking for. I mean, if someone has to take the time to really write out in a survey or email response exactly about what they're looking for, no one has time for that. But when you can lead UX a person through a conversation to tell us what it is, what do you need and how do you expect it to react, and how do you expect it to function like there is no opportunity to ask those questions right back on on a piece of paper or through a screen.

00:17:15:07 - 00:17:58:01 Audrey Vandenbroeck And so, you know, learning why we were the chosen partner for their livelihood, to sustain their business, to grow their business was key. That helped marketing change their verbiage, their point of view. Some of our landing pages with, you know, some of the, reasons why people use our service for that particular industry or persona identification. Right. It helped our product team, you know, maybe rearrange their product scope, because more often enough, a request that was maybe in the middle pack of the task list is now at the top of the list, right?

00:17:58:03 - 00:18:14:19 Audrey Vandenbroeck And I think what we all got out of it was the why. Why us? Why this product, why it works the way it does. What results are you seeing and how are you going to be able to amplify it? Still using our products and you can't get that again through written work.

00:18:14:22 - 00:18:34:25 Joshua Zerkel You know, you miss out on so much of the nuance and the thinking behind the words and the feeling. And one thing that we really underestimate, in my experience, is not everyone is equally well versed in communicating verbally as they are, you know, written word. And so we hyper anchor on, well, it's just easier to click the survey.

00:18:34:25 - 00:18:59:10 Joshua Zerkel But what if someone doesn't feel comfortable communicating in writing? Or maybe they're like your surveys only in English and English as a second language for them, you're missing all of the nuance in what they would actually say. And so I feel like having these alternative ways that people can offer their thoughts and opinions, some of it feedback, some of it things that they just think, are so valuable when you have these different ways for them to contribute it.

00:18:59:12 - 00:19:05:12 Joshua Zerkel And when you lock people into just one way, you're going to get one type of feedback. And it won't always be the kind that's useful for you.

00:19:05:15 - 00:19:22:08 Audrey Vandenbroeck You bring up a really great point. I think when you write out feedback or your concerns, you have again that time to think about what you want to say. You may type a sentence out, you might delete it, you might type sentence out again, delete it again, and then all of a sudden your voice is no longer your voice.

00:19:22:08 - 00:19:47:28 Audrey Vandenbroeck You may see cloud or ChatGPT to help craft your response again, not your voice. When you have that human human interaction through initiative like a campfire series, your question is asked and whatever comes to mind right then and there is what you're going to say, because oftentimes it's the most truthful, it's the most compelling, in the most real you're going to get from your customer.

00:19:48:00 - 00:19:56:25 Joshua Zerkel Yeah. It's honest. It's unfiltered to the dimension that they don't have time to carefully crafted. It's what they're thinking, written what they feel, and what's typically honest.

00:19:56:27 - 00:20:01:18 Audrey Vandenbroeck Unfiltered. That's the exact word I was looking for. So yeah, definitely unfiltered.

00:20:01:20 - 00:20:19:05 Joshua Zerkel Yeah. Well, Roland has dropped in a question. Thank you. Roland, nice to see you. His question, how do you keep community conversations and let's say, customer conversations relevant to your business, while also leading with wonder and exploring whatever those folks are actually interested in?

00:20:19:08 - 00:21:01:03 Audrey Vandenbroeck Yeah. Great question. So I made it a point not to ask my colleagues in other departments what they wanted to seek out of these conversations. I kept it guardrails and controlled on purpose and intentionally. Again, too much time to think crafts for something that you weren't exactly expecting or was hoping for. And, you know, keeping it relevant was going through the series of questions that I had prepared based on my pre call with my customers, as well as those ten very strategically, like pointed out questions, kind of like what James Lipton had during his time on his show.

00:21:01:05 - 00:21:20:17 Audrey Vandenbroeck And so it kept that wonder, like, what's Audrey going to ask? And is she going to hit the points that pertain to me and products that pertain to me in engineering, like, how is she going to cover all these bases? And somehow it did that you ask a question to a customer, and it could be the only question that you ask him.

00:21:20:17 - 00:21:42:08 Audrey Vandenbroeck About 30 minutes series, but yet all departments were able to take something away. If again, you just kind of understand and feel relaxed with your recipient. And I found that oftentimes they were very relaxed to kind of go, you know, all out with their unfiltered context of why, again, they chose us for a partner.

00:21:42:11 - 00:22:03:11 Joshua Zerkel But one of the things that I think is really stood out to me about the way that you've structured and leveraged to campfire campfire stories is how you made those conversations visible and usable across the company, which I think is probably a big part of why they were effective, rather than just keeping that those conversations siloed just to see us.

00:22:03:13 - 00:22:19:00 Joshua Zerkel When your cross-functional stakeholders heard what real people, real customers, were actually thinking saying what changed instead of them just hearing the summarized version? What were some of the differences that you saw within your own organization?

00:22:19:02 - 00:22:37:29 Audrey Vandenbroeck Yeah, I mean, every department, was asked to join these campfire stories, and it was always interesting to sit down during lunch and listen to an HR representative talk about, hey, remember the campfire story that customer said X, Y, and Z? And then the engineer at the end of the table was like, yeah, what do you think of that?

00:22:37:29 - 00:23:11:26 Audrey Vandenbroeck And the HR representative is expressing their thoughts and their concerns and their point of view. Again, an HR representative not involved in product scoping, engineering decisions, marketing campaigns, none of that. Right. But they've offered insights, you know, a number of times about, you know, coming from my perception as someone that sits in the air, right, I see their voice as valuable because and it's just like you want to turn your head and say, go.

00:23:11:28 - 00:23:38:20 Audrey Vandenbroeck H.R. Right. Thank you for leading in finance the same way. Right? I mean, at the end of the day, we want to be in the positive revenue wise, but they're leaning in. They're not just focused on the numbers, they're listening to the context and how again, you know, from my point of view with running the numbers, are you sure our product roadmap is the right one based on our growth trajectory?

00:23:38:23 - 00:24:02:11 Audrey Vandenbroeck Right. So it was able to bring us all outside the box. And again every leader at the top bought into this initiative. They talked about it during their weekly meetings with their respective teams. Those directors went down to their IQs. They talked about it and it was a full circle thing. All I did was moderate. All I did was find our customers and ask them, hey, can you join us for this campfire story?

00:24:02:11 - 00:24:35:00 Audrey Vandenbroeck I'd love to talk to you and because my name was kind of everywhere at my former organization, they knew I was a real person. And so that was also easy to six year, great, customers for these dialogs. But once they saw, you know, the zoom full of, like, the 175 people that we had at the organization all join, they were like, okay, this company has my back, this company is invested in me, so I'm going to invest back in them.

00:24:35:02 - 00:24:44:26 Joshua Zerkel I love that I did. Just as an aside, did any customer ever feel intimidated that there are so many people listening?

00:24:44:28 - 00:25:18:10 Audrey Vandenbroeck Oh yeah. But that didn't deter them from being unfiltered and candid and openly honest. Even with the not so great stuff that the product had at the time. You know, like, why can't it do this? And I have feature questions. I have product on the line, right. There was no shying away from it. Again, it was them using their voice that I empowered from the very start to use in order to make their livelihood better, because without their voice, we can't help them sustain their business or help them grow.

00:25:18:12 - 00:25:34:01 Audrey Vandenbroeck So that was the over arching message is I'm empowering you to say what you need to say. You have a full audience. 30 minutes of our time once a month. Let's go. Let's hear it.

00:25:34:03 - 00:25:53:05 Joshua Zerkel I love it. Well, in our last few minutes, I want to remind everyone who's with us live that if you have a question, feel free to drop it in us. My last couple of closing questions in the interim. So for anyone who wants to get started with campfire stories or something like this around structured customer conversations, where would you tell them to start?

00:25:53:07 - 00:26:17:08 Audrey Vandenbroeck I would get buy in from your C-suite and say, hey, C-suite, I think we have a disconnect. Maybe you don't have a disconnect, but maybe you want to strengthen your ties to your users. You want to strengthen your community. Maybe you see some gaps somewhere in the process of retaining feedback or disseminating feedback. I would approach your C-suite because you're going to need buy in from all of them.

00:26:17:13 - 00:26:49:20 Audrey Vandenbroeck Not just your CEO, not just your CFO, but everyone that is a leader within your company. And the reason why is they need to have your back to help you institute this. They need to drive advocacy to have all of their direct reports come to these meetings, to come to these campfire stories. Right? They're going to have to roar and rally behind you and make it a forefront of dialog in all the conversations they have that is, that warrants it.

00:26:49:22 - 00:27:06:02 Audrey Vandenbroeck Right? And so you're going to need to want to speak to your C-suite and be like, this is something I know we can do to institute, and it's going to take very little labor to do. It takes one person, but it's going to impact the entire organization as well as our business.

00:27:06:04 - 00:27:16:07 Joshua Zerkel I love it, and as if someone is spinning something like this up, what are some of the mistakes or traps that you'd say they should avoid or sidestep along the way?

00:27:16:09 - 00:27:41:06 Audrey Vandenbroeck Yeah, I'm seeking feedback. In terms of, hey, these are the questions I really want you to ask as it pertains to my department now, right. I tried that once. It kind of backfired on me because it became too department centric of the department that asked me to focus on what they asked me to focus on, and it didn't become widespread and it wasn't gravitating to the entire organization.

00:27:41:06 - 00:28:02:01 Audrey Vandenbroeck So it became very one sided. I say, stick with your gut, stick with the flow. You know, your customers best mean if you're going to institute this, it's because you genuinely feel like you know them the best and you know how they work and possibly how they think about the use of your product or your service. So go with your flow.

00:28:02:02 - 00:28:21:17 Audrey Vandenbroeck Go with your pace and your tone. Go with your own vibe. Right? Because that's why customers are agreeing to meet with you and spend time with you during these campfire stories. It's because of your personal commitment and and, relationship with them. That's what's going to make that successful.

00:28:21:20 - 00:28:25:03 Joshua Zerkel Yeah, they see it and they feel it, and that's why they want to participate, I would imagine.

00:28:25:06 - 00:28:27:04 Audrey Vandenbroeck Exactly.

00:28:27:06 - 00:28:33:21 Joshua Zerkel All right, Audrey, thank you so much for this. This has been great. Where would you like folks to find you online?

00:28:33:23 - 00:28:45:19 Audrey Vandenbroeck You can find me on LinkedIn. My LinkedIn is yours, Audrey Vanden Brook. Or you can email me, and I can have I just give that to Josh and Josh. You can send it out in your correspondence as well.

00:28:45:21 - 00:29:07:24 Joshua Zerkel We'll do all right. Audrey, thank you so much. This was fantastic. I love this concept of campfire stories. And really getting deep into the conversations with customers in a way that's valuable for everyone. So thank you for sharing. Everyone who's been with us live. Thank you for joining us. I invite everyone to check out future events at Community graduate.com, and we'll see you all in the future.

00:29:07:27 - 00:29:10:24 Joshua Zerkel Thank you all so much and thanks again. Audrey. This is really awesome.

00:29:10:27 - 00:29:12:26 Audrey Vandenbroeck Thank you. Thank you everyone. Have a great day.